I have spent the last 2 days, 1 day each playing with Forte and JBuilder. I'll write up my findings in another email. But for those people using either of these tools, do you find them to have bugs up the wazoo? Maybe its just the Linux variants, but they both crash alot. -- Minneapolis St. Paul Twin Cities MN | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.mn-linux.org Minnesota Linux | Fax : (952)943-8500 Key fingerprint = 6C E9 51 4F D5 3E 4C 66 62 A9 10 E5 35 85 39 D9